Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Foreign
[00:00:03] Speaker B: welcome to the Canadian Basketball show, your go to spot for the latest news stories and analysis on Canadian basketball. I'm your host, Lee Ban Osman.
This week I'm joined by a real special guest, can of Basketball President and CEO Michael Bartlett. How you been?
[00:00:22] Speaker A: I've been all right. Lee, man, how about you? Good, good, good.
[00:00:24] Speaker B: Can't complain. It's been a while. I think we had you on last August.
I kind of want to space it because I want to like have you on so close. I feel like there's not many updates, but now that we're kind of gearing up for the summer, I feel like a big summer within the organization and a lot of stuff happening with whether it's age group stuff, senior men's national team stuff and yeah, a lot of excitement, a lot of excitement from people.
What's the last few months been like for you? Busy.
[00:00:52] Speaker A: Yeah, listen, there's no, it does feel like there's no off season despite the fact like our reality is we're not on court competing all the time. But you know, the amount of work that goes in behind the scenes trying to keep the business engine going, the athlete development engine going.
Yeah, it's a, it's busy. A lot of travel, a lot of connectivity across. Like we're spending a ton of time making the case for more funding for sport with government, spending a lot of time collaborating with FIBA. We're, we're a top ranked nation now in FIBA's reputation ranking too. Not just in, in the way that we're ranked in our age group and senior teams. So we're spending a lot of time working on big ideas with them.
I'm already like, I'm happy to say, like we're already starting to put a model together for what pre2028 Olympics would look like across Canada tour. Like that's the stuff that you got to work on now. You can't wait till you officially qualify. You can't wait till six months before the game. So we're pulling all that stuff together too now.
And listen, we've got players playing almost every night somewhere in the world. So our basketball leadership team and the high performance team, they're busy all the time, traveling, staying in touch with the coaches, the athletes, ncaa, Europe and NBA and wnba. So busy times.
[00:02:12] Speaker B: Just announced a FIBA World cup qualifiers game in Quebec City August 31st. I was shocked. I tweeted this out.
A lot of people are excited about this. I was shocked. I'm like, Quebec really got people like
[00:02:22] Speaker A: that in five hours. We sold 10% of the inventory.
It. It's going right. And we haven't. We haven't actually announced the game time or who the opponent is.
If you start to look at, okay, a scoop, we're going to cross over to the other qualification pool for that window.
[00:02:42] Speaker B: Yep.
[00:02:43] Speaker A: By the looks of it, we'll go Panama on the road and if everything stays the same in the next. In the June qualifying window, will be able to host Argentina in Quebec City. So that'll be a good one.
[00:02:56] Speaker B: Oh, that'd be amazing. Yeah. Argentina's tough team.
[00:03:00] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:03:01] Speaker B: Why Quebec City? First time, I think in like seven, eight years. I believe around that time. Why Quebec City?
[00:03:07] Speaker A: That's a big reason. Like why Quebec in general, the growth of basketball in Quebec, our relationship with Carl Como at Quebec Basketball association, one of our really thriving PTSOs.
We've got some players that have obviously got Quebec roots and want to come home. So we're going to Hamilton. We've got some hometown roots planted there. For Shea. Going to Quebec as a province in Quebec City, hometown roots for guys like Lou and Ben and others. So it's important for us to start really moving our operation across the country.
[00:03:37] Speaker B: I forgot to mention, we have a lot of questions that people sent in. They're going to be answered after I get through my questions that I have for you.
[00:03:44] Speaker A: It's your show.
[00:03:46] Speaker B: It's early, though. You mentioned going to Hamilton, home of Shea, going to Quebec, close to Lou Dort's area, Montreal North.
It's early. Like I said, players going through the NBA playoffs.
But how many guys can people expect, like Canadian NBA players to suit up this summer? I'm guessing you're in conversations with Rowan, with Gordy Herbert about what that will look like, what commitment will look like.
Is there expectation that, like Hamilton? I'm like, I think a lot of people are expecting Shane to play. Right. So, like, what's.
But it's so early. Right. It's like these guys might go through the playoffs. I know the July game is like, July 3rd.
[00:04:25] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:04:25] Speaker B: NBA playoffs, finals, knock on wood. Everyone's healthy. Like, what's the expectation when it comes to NBA guys?
[00:04:32] Speaker A: Well, what I can share right now is Rowan Gordy are having, like, there's commitment letters out with the guys right now. So we've got about 55 athletes, winter, summer, next three years, and they've been asked to commit to what the next three years will look like.
We also recognize that not everybody's going to be available for every window. NBA guys aren't available in the winter.
But when they are, we want them to run with us. Gordy prioritizes, and I think if you look at his history with Germany, he prioritized having a roster for three distinct summers consistently.
That's why Hardenstein got cut from that team, because he wasn't able to be part in year one. And he said, if not year one, not year two, not year three. That's Gordy's ethos.
And when you're competing against the best in the world or in Paris, the USAB Avengers, sometimes continuity and consistency is a secret sauce that you can bring that you can't necessarily have if you just field an all star team at the drop of a hat. So what? While we do have the capacity for an all star team now, we have to value continuity. So what I can say in the good news scenario in that is like, our guys are committed, they want to play. That's not the question.
I don't probably. After we spoke last time last summer, our Alphas like Shay and RJ and Nikhil and Dylan and Lou, they requested a camp. They actually said, are we getting together this summer? We're like, no, no, you got the summer off. They're like, no, no, no, no, let's get together.
We have to get together to learn how to beat the best. So, you know, Gordy was kind of in under the COVID of Darkness. He wasn't officially with us yet. He'd installed some systems, had some meetings. Nathaniel ran camp for the America, while our Alphas were also getting together and having some runs.
Not with the main camp, but getting together. Right. So the these guys are in. That is not a question. So how that plays out this summer? These guys are in.
[00:06:36] Speaker B: That's a good point. Because when I was at the FIBA America cup meet availability, I saw Dylan Brooks talking to Keyshawn George, like just giving me advice or certain stuff. And who else I saw coming? I saw Lou Dore, I saw Ben Matheran, those guys coming out all day.
[00:06:50] Speaker A: That was because they demanded it of the program. And boy, is that ever fun to hear.
[00:06:54] Speaker B: Is there any exceptions though? Like when I talk about these, the three year, like certain guys might be, hey, contract situation coming up. Like, I'm thinking of Lou Dort, for example, right? Ben Matheran just got situated to the Clippers, right. Is there any exception when it comes
[00:07:10] Speaker A: to like this three year being in can be considered different from playing, you still have to be there, right? Like we're installing systems and we're running programs and establishing relationships.
All of that can be happening whether or not they can physically play in said game either because of contract situation, which is insurance reasons. They're not playing because they don't want to, because they're not contract and can't get a insurance from NBA and fiba. Secondly, injury, that's going to pop up. But if you're injured, as was our philosophy in the last quad, if you're injured, you still got to be there. You got to be part of the exercise, you got to be in the meetings, you got to be building the relationship so the guys will be there. Yeah.
[00:07:54] Speaker B: What's that like when you get all this buy in? And what's the conversation like with Gordy? Have you had much combos with him? I know he was at Bayern. I know he got sick at one point and then they parted ways. What's that been like for him since? And I think we were chatting, like, what's the expectations for Gordy going for now?
[00:08:12] Speaker A: Yeah, Rowan and Gordy are tethered. They're talking all the time, you know, and with our broader coaching staff, we announced, as you know, you know, last summer, a broader coaching pool. They're connecting all the time. They're doing technical development, systems development all the time. Even the guys that are in the NBA coaching are tethered into that.
So, yeah, Gordy's expectation, his demand is he wants to coach us every single window from here on in, all the way through to la. So that means this summer, but that also means November and February of next year to complete the World cup qualifying and then through to the Olympics.
[00:08:46] Speaker B: Media availability in July for Gordy. I'm waiting for.
[00:08:49] Speaker A: Oh, yeah, he's coming. He's coming. I think. Yeah, we know he's excited, actually. He told Rowan today he wants to make sure that the coaches come into camp a few days early too, so they can have like a technical summit. And certainly Gordy will be available for all you guys.
[00:09:03] Speaker B: Yeah, I'm excited for that. And talking about commitment, what is when we're thinking about the players itself, is the feeling that a lot of guys are just bought in.
[00:09:16] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. Like I, I get the benefit of being. We. We sent out, as I said, the 54 letters, I think. And every morning I, I click on the link to see because Rowan and Sebastian, our, our director of team ops, they've been putting a check mark beside every guy who actually sent his letter back and signed. And the deadline's tomorrow, today being Thursday, April 16th, deadline, 17th. And I can say there's a lot of check marks there that'll make everybody happy.
[00:09:43] Speaker B: When are you expecting to release those? Is that later on?
[00:09:46] Speaker A: Yeah, because now the way that it was done and rightfully so, show your intentions to commit. And now, you know, you got to be selected into camp, you got to be selected into roster. So that all starts to play out. Like, let's. We got to let everybody finish their NBA season, their European season before any of that starts. I can be pretty sure that we'll start to talk about a committed group midway through May, start to talk about summer rosters into June. And certainly we owe the fans in Hamilton and Quebec City some clarity on who will be coming and everybody's going to be happy.
[00:10:19] Speaker B: Is there a number range that people can expect or is just like it's
[00:10:23] Speaker A: too early for the summer group? I think these guys are going to
[00:10:26] Speaker B: be playing in Puerto Rico, Jamaica, Quebec City, or is it different?
[00:10:30] Speaker A: Well, listen, budget dictates sometimes how many we can have in camp, and we're still not, you know, we're still not where I want to be budget wise, but I think we're going to have anywhere from 18 to 20 guys in camp for sure.
[00:10:42] Speaker B: Excited for that. I'm also excited about the age group stuff happening. FIBA U17, 18 camps that you had, I think at St. Catharines for the women's and for the men's, it was at Humber. I wasn't able to get to St. Catharines too far for me, but I was at the Humber one right before I flew out to the Nike Hoop Summit. And I just want to like, say, well done. That was like, when I watched, I was like, wow, this is a very fun scrimmage. And years prior it was behind closed doors. I would still go to it. I think a lot of people in the basketball community would still go to it. But this time you guys streamed it for people to see what went into that idea, the process and what's been the feedback. Because I think it's one of the best decisions I've seen, like, from a national team, to be honest. Just to be able to see that deal, see the talent and like give people an inside look into your selection process, your selection camps, you know.
[00:11:42] Speaker A: Yeah, I think it's a proud moment, personally, because when you actually dig into how we got there, it's through the best collaboration between our high performance group and our business group that has led to this. And. And again, shout out to a. A partner in Gatorade that is also unlocking the opportunity to elevate a camp as a camp is a camp unless you make it More than the camp and high performance has always wanted to elevate. Because listen, athlete experience is really important now more than ever. Because if they're not choosing to spend your time with you, they can choose to spend their time with, with something else with all this opportunity that they have now, AAU Hoop Summit, whatever.
But we, unlike a pro franchise, we get to foster a relationship with these athletes at 14, 15, 17, 18, 19.
So the experience they have with you now actually imprints on whether they're going to choose you seven years from now. When you say, hey, you want to give up your summer in a contract year and come roll with us to an America, well, they're going to remember the experience they had at a U17 camp. So the business team, along with the high performance team was able to collaborate and create this elevated camp experience which then also created this streaming experience which is also part of our objection or our objective as an organization. Let these athletes be seen by more people that need to see them and not just you because you're interested in basketball and you're telling the stories of basketball, but the NCAA programs that are looking at these kids, they're looking, they can be sitting in Kentucky and North Carolina and Gonzaga at their desk and say, I'm going to watch that right now. And that's something that we offer our players now that we didn't offer before. But that's part of the athlete promise too.
[00:13:30] Speaker B: Yeah. I've seen some people though complain about the timing of these camps. Yeah.
Would schedule like conflicting with like championships. I think North Pole Hoops, npa, they had a championship going on and from what I've heard, it was like that championship conflicted with like the timing of the camp for St. Catharines to happen. Right.
And then for the men's side, all Canadian games is happening at the same time. So it's like some of the top players that I was looking for to see all Canadian, I'm like, I can't see them because now they're at Canada Basketball Camp.
What's that?
I'm guessing you probably heard complaints about that too. What's that dialogue been.
Been. Been like with them? And what's your, yeah. What's your response to kind of like that being like conflicting with a lot of the other stuff, basketball wise happening.
[00:14:18] Speaker A: Yeah. And listen, I get it. Everybody, everybody wants to deliver their best possible product, tournament outcome and we want to deliver our best possible training opportunity as well because we've got finite opportunities to do that. I will say, like as it comes to, to the men's Easter camp, it's always been the men's Easter camp. Easter is Easter, so Easter floats, but we float with it.
So everybody in the sector knows that. I think what is different now is as we look at long term athlete development really policies, but what's healthy for the athlete. We made the decision, and this applied to Northville Hoops championship weekend and the women's camp as well, that you can't be in both environments at once.
One, it's unhealthy for the athletes really at the end of the day, if they're training here, in the training here, there's more chance for breakage. We've actually seen injury opportunity come from athletes trying to be in two places at once in years past. So I don't blame the program. In fact, I applaud the program for saying make a choice.
I also think, and this is a message to every young person out there, life requires choice.
We don't ask my own kids, I don't ask them enough to say like, ah, you can't have both things. It is only one.
And you can, you have to learn early that you got to make a choice now. In no environment did we tell the athlete, if you don't come, you are out. All we said is you got to make a choice. It can't be both.
And I will say both men's and women's programs with North Pole hoops and the team at All Canadian.
Lots of conversations about how to navigate it. We landed where we landed, but we didn't stick our head in the sand and avoid the conversations. And nor did they.
But we didn't land where everybody was happy. Fine, but that's life. You're not going to land where everybody is happy.
[00:16:15] Speaker B: Yeah. What do you say to some people that feel like, hey, there should be more collaboration, like scheduling ahead of time. It's like I feel you said everyone knows you guys are doing the Easter camp during that time. Do you feel like there should be more communication between like, everybody be like, let's be, I want to say flexible, but like, hey, we should know this is happening here. Schedule, do not schedule anything on this date ahead of time. Do you feel like there was communication around that?
[00:16:38] Speaker A: I do. Like I was part of emails where our athletes in that pipeline got months of advance notice.
Light bulb goes off. Okay, who are the other stakeholders that we have to tell as well? Because it's not just our athletes. It's maybe the clubs where our athletes play. It's maybe the organizations that we know exist that Create platforms for athletes in this country. Okay, lesson learned. We'll make sure that it's cast wide.
But what I also want to ask is that the sector has to recognize, okay, who's compromise is a two way street.
It can't just be the national team's responsibility to be the one to compromise.
It's the national team.
Yes, there are more opportunities for these athletes than ever before to shine and be seen. But still, ultimately the national team is a major engine in that exercise for them.
So there has to be compromise from the sector and the system to recognize that a national team opportunity is a crested opportunity for a child.
[00:17:41] Speaker B: I agree with that. A lot of people excited about the FIBA U17 Boys World cup in Turkey. I've been following a lot of the talents.
I think a lot of people are calling this like the golden generation. I feel it's too much pressure. I don't want to like you don't put that on guys.
[00:17:55] Speaker A: You know what I'm gonna say?
I'm fine to call it the golden generation when we win gold.
[00:18:00] Speaker B: Okay. I was gonna ask.
[00:18:02] Speaker A: We're not there yet.
[00:18:02] Speaker B: How excited are you and is there like pressure to win?
[00:18:06] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:18:06] Speaker B: A World cup specifically because I'm thinking the last time on the men's side like the they want a World cup gold was maybe what, 20, 21 run out of time. Is there pressure? What's that conversation like?
[00:18:17] Speaker A: We have U17, I think.
[00:18:19] Speaker B: No, yeah, I'm talking about just U19. Oh yeah, 20, 21.
[00:18:22] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:18:23] Speaker B: But is there pressure? It's been what it's going to be five years since Ometo on an age group level in the World Cup.
[00:18:30] Speaker A: Yeah.
Is there pressure? There should be pressure.
You know, was it Grange that asked me after the Olympics, did we set the expectation too high? Not too high. We set the expectation where it should be. We should win. We're damn good at basketball. Our systems are great, our players are great, our coaches are great.
But I'll remind everybody that greatness loses too from time to time. It's win and continue losing out type of basketball. That's a different setup and yeah, but I do put a lot of pressure on our organization and our coaches and our systems to win.
But more importantly to recognize that like we're not going to win everything.
But we must have no excuses. We must be able to look ourselves in the eye afterwards and say like that just came down to being beat. If we get beat, we get beat. If we do something to beat ourselves, that's on us and we're doing that less and less and less as an organization than ever before. And I'm happy about that.
[00:19:35] Speaker B: Yeah. Talking about not winning everything. Senior woman's national team.
[00:19:38] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:19:38] Speaker B: Didn't qualify for the World cup for the first time since 2002.
[00:19:43] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:19:44] Speaker B: What were your thoughts watching that qualifying tournament? And in your eyes, like, what. What went wrong?
[00:19:50] Speaker A: Yeah. Thoughts.
Some words not to be used on the pod, but. Yeah. Like, I couldn't. Couldn't have been more disappointed and frankly pissed off at the world in that situation. Not at the world itself, but just like, you're just mad.
Yeah. Really tough to go through. I know how much preparation Steve and the leadership, coaches and Nell, the players put into that. There are some factors that sound like excuses that I'll point to of an important tournament in March at a time when our reality is our athlete baton pass is happening right now across some generations. And there were some very impactful athletes that would typically play a role for us now at the senior team that are in the middle of their conference championships at ncaa, and there's no chance they're coming.
But that does really sound like an excuse. What happened? Well, we weren't clutch when we needed to be. We didn't offensively rebound when we needed two, and we made it impossible on ourselves after the first quarter against Turkey to control our own destiny.
We win that Turkey game, which was the plan and is the plan and should have been the outcome, we control the rest of the way. We're 30 after three games, and we're in. So you learn some hard lessons about controlling your controllables. Now, listen, sometimes shots don't go in. Sometimes Turkey head home court advantage. It swings you 6, 7 points, but still no excuses.
It's not a qualification result that should happen, and certainly not one that we're resting on.
[00:21:36] Speaker B: Do you feel like the senior Women's national team is kind of like in a rebuild phase? Okay. Because I look at it as, like, you have a lot of veterans that in a few years might not be with the program. Like, to be blunt, you know, uh, and. But then you have this new wave of talent coming in college that's like, I wish they can be there every single time. But you mentioned, obviously conference tournaments, playing in NCAA tournament, can't be there. Right. They got to be with the program.
What's that like, that transition period and how are you guys preparing for that? And what's the conversations like, where it's like, hey, we gotta handle this phase right now. And, like, it might not be pretty.
[00:22:15] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:22:16] Speaker B: It.
[00:22:17] Speaker A: There's no perfect way to do.
There's no perfect way to manage roster transitions because also too, you're.
We're not a pro team. We're going to play.
There's going to be a trade. You're going to play 81 games or 82 games together. There's a trade deadline, there's a free agency period. You can turn a roster over in pieces.
Sometimes the people that are coming up aren't available to you, as we just found out. So you have to be deep. That's on us. We gotta be deep because you're never gonna have the same 12 every time.
And you can't then point to who isn't there.
So we just have to be. We have to be more disciplined and I would say pragmatic in having real conversations with ourselves with our coaches, with our athletes about what we need from you in what, what moment, at what time.
And also to a degree, putting.
You know, it's not a FEBA common practice to roll young.
It tends to be like. I call it adult basketball. It is adult basketball. It's like we're talking 26 and up. Tends to be like the average age of feba.
But you know, maybe we got a pressure test young this summer. We are now in a tournament this summer in August of the teams that didn't qualify for the World Cup. FIBA gives you the president of having to go to a tournament anyway.
[00:23:47] Speaker B: So the losers bracket.
[00:23:48] Speaker A: Yeah, unfortunately. Can you.
[00:23:51] Speaker B: Can you say no, we don't show
[00:23:52] Speaker A: it to you can then you get sanctioned.
But there is a benefit for going because if we win that tournament, we automatically enter the OQT without having played in the World Cup. So there is a benefit there. So we gotta go win that damn thing. And it'll be against Brazil, Senegal, I forget a whole bunch. South Korea and some others. So we gotta go win that thing. But maybe we gotta go young and pressure test. Right? Maybe.
So Steve and Nell and the team are talking about like, what does it look like to start the transition of those athletes being pressure. Like we saw it at the end of America women this past summer in overtime. Delaney the Silo to win the game. And there was also three other like there was of the four athletes on the court because so many had unfortunately fouled out after such a long game.
We were like average age of 22.
So good thing about this next generation of athletes coming up, they're damn fearless. Like that moment doesn't bother them because they're involved in moment big moments in their NCAA programs all the time.
And making nil money. That puts a lot of pressure on them to deliver by the university. So I think they're pressure tested in a different way. And Steve and Nell are talking about, you know, how we expedite some of that development in them.
[00:25:17] Speaker B: Did you expect to have to go this young so early?
[00:25:20] Speaker A: No.
[00:25:22] Speaker B: And what are like the next priorities in terms of like what Steve, what Nell are talking about? Like that we need to focus on. You talked about going young.
Anything else that you're like, hey, we need to adjust to this because countries are getting better.
[00:25:35] Speaker A: Yeah, that's the great thing. Like this. This isn't that Canada's gotten worse. It's the world has gotten better. It's why the future World Cups are going to be 16 teams for women and not 12.
We've been involved in looking at a future World cup for 2030 and it's going to be 16 teams, not 12. So that's a reflection of world progress, which is great.
Here's what I will say.
We also have to understand, for years qualification was just happening. We almost took it for granted.
This August we have to game plan to qualify for the Olympic qualifier. If we don't do it this August, that means we gotta go finish. I think based on the math, top two in America.
Well, maybe in those two situations we're turning to a WNBA athlete or two to say in your CBA you are allowed to leave for national team play in the middle of a season.
We need you.
Would you consider coming along with some of our up and coming talent? Along with listen and listen. We still got a lot of vets and women who have carried this program for a long time that are still amazing contributors. So we have to figure out the perfect puzzle. But then maybe we also have to ask athletes along the way to make a choice to do the thing that they've never had to do before, which is walk away from a pro season here or even walk away from an NCAA season there.
[00:27:10] Speaker B: That's funny that you mentioned that point because I think about, I don't feel like it really happens or like North American players are like, okay, I can just go play for the national team or I'll just go. I feel like that's more of a European culture where it's like, national team come first. I'm always gonna do that. But then I think about Sila. And Sila was like, I went to Michigan because I want to be closer and I want to be able to go do all this stuff with Canada basketball.
Is there sentiment that players would be interested in like if they're in the pro season. Obviously I'm thinking about players like Aaliyah Edwards. Right. I'm thinking about the Bridget Carltons of the world. Right. But I don't know if they ever had that decision come across.
[00:27:46] Speaker A: We haven't put that decision on them before and these are now the conversations that we have to have with the athletes. Not necessarily putting the decision on them, but they've grown up with us and we've grown up with them as a program. So the good news is about those relationships is you can have mature conversations and explore whether or not something would be possible or not and then also respect if it's not.
But everybody's got to know the reality sometimes. If it's not, it could be harder for us.
[00:28:13] Speaker B: Despite missing the World cup, is there something that keeps you hopeful about what Steve but what Nell are doing at
[00:28:19] Speaker A: the third ranked age group program in women's basketball globally? Yeah, that keeps me hopeful.
Watching the NCAA tournament, that keeps me hopeful.
We had a lot of athletes performing in the biggest stages of their lives so far, incredibly well.
And frankly, if you watch back the games in the World cup qualifier, also a lot of reason to be hopeful. We performed really well and we lost three games in ways, in controllable ways that if we in the moment were better in the moment.
We're not having this conversation. So it's not like we weren't in it. In fact, this sounds really crazy to say.
I've had FIBA reps say this to me. They're like, you guys are actually, performance wise the best team in your pool, but you weren't the best when it mattered in those moments.
But on aggregate, your points for your points against all that stuff you performed, but we lost. When you got to lose the right games in fiba, you're going to lose a game, you got to lose the right game.
[00:29:37] Speaker B: Yep. I'm hopeful though. We just saw three Canadians drafted. WNBA Carly Clark. What are your thoughts on her assistant coach with the Toronto tackle?
[00:29:44] Speaker A: I'm happy for Carly. So happy for Carly. Happy for this.
[00:29:46] Speaker B: Did you see this coming?
[00:29:47] Speaker A: Yes. Yeah. Yes.
[00:29:48] Speaker B: You probably text where you're like, hey, nah.
[00:29:51] Speaker A: No, like we. We've been a big supporter of our coaching network when the tempo landed, you know, we've been shameless advocates for the people in our system to get opportunities.
And listen, we didn't have to talk too much about Carly for Carly to be on radars. And she wasn't just on the tempo's radar. She's a great coach.
[00:30:15] Speaker B: I was saying after they won the OUA championship I was like what's Carly gonna consider making the jump? I was like, I was gonna text her be like what are you making the jump? I was gonna. Happy to see her with the tempo. Rad.
[00:30:27] Speaker A: Yeah, happy for her. Happy like it's kind of a mixed.
A Canadian went first overall in the expansion draft and just signed a three year max contract. I would have loved for it to been the tempo.
[00:30:38] Speaker B: Right.
[00:30:38] Speaker A: But man that's what a great opportunity for Bridget. Yeah, great opportunity.
[00:30:42] Speaker B: I heard Portland wanted her bad.
[00:30:43] Speaker A: Oh bad.
[00:30:44] Speaker B: Next time I see Bridget Carlton we ask for some spare change.
We're at the 30 minute mark.
So many questions listeners sent in. I want to get to them and hope I can get to all of them. A lot of people sent in questions which is dope.
And let's jump here to keeping on the senior women's national team. Someone sent in the question, are you able to share how you're approaching the building of the Women's Team for LA 2028 if you guys qualify? This is more of a question I think for Steve to be honest with you. But what's your convos been like like we talked about after World cup but what's the building process like for maybe looking at on the Olympic roster?
[00:31:25] Speaker A: Yeah and listen, we're required almost every year to project out 4 year and 8 year roster cycles for on the podium. So that's again the really cool part of national team sport and something that doesn't exist in the pro ranks. Maybe aside from European soccer where they have an academy we can project out athletes all the way out to 2036 probably because we're looking back in academy, we're looking at U17s and we're projecting out. So yeah, I think ultimately we recognize there's going to be more WNBA athletes from Canada than ever before in the next five years. Yeah, certainly between now and la a whole bunch of them coming through as well.
Great that we had three draft picks and everybody.
Sarah Williams is kind of hidden underneath Brooklyn. Yeah.
[00:32:11] Speaker B: Do we claim her? I think we claim her.
[00:32:13] Speaker A: Yeah. Damn right we do. Yeah, I saw her almost officially.
[00:32:16] Speaker B: I saw a global jam almost soon.
Cassandra Prosper. Yeah, she was on that U19. I think she won metal with with Carly there trash too.
[00:32:26] Speaker A: So like listen, there'll be, there'll be more in the league than ever before that. With that comes some of its complications as well because as you see USAB competing in summer windows, their athletes show up just before the tournament. Right. So we have to be smart enough to be ready. And we're getting together for a camp in Montreal in June with as many athletes as we can, including the NCAA one's coming up. The end the W athletes won't be available then. We're going to Victoria again in July before we go to this tournament in August.
We're talking, we're working right now to bring up an NCAA program to come run against us in Victoria because our roster is so young. That could be a nice little like challenge for them too. A good, good mix, kind of global jam light so to speak for us in Victoria, which would be great.
So yeah, Steve and Nell have projected out various roster scenarios. It's all going to come down to more time together and we're going to need more camps than ever to do that. So we're budgeting for that and planning for that.
[00:33:26] Speaker B: Somebody asked, does the result of like student was national team missing the World Cup? Does that change how like Canada basketball allocates resources between programs at all?
[00:33:39] Speaker A: No, certainly not. Not between programs. We're you know, really proud of the fact that we're on a per camp, per competition basis really trying to keep things level in, in recognition of the athlete needs and what the athlete deserves.
I think there are some considerations if we're not going to the World cup and we had some budget allocated to that, how are we investing that in next gen development, not just automatically to senior team. So Steve and Nell will have some discretion on that and you know, at our intention, we're not necessarily hiding that money in mattresses. We spend every dollar we bring in much that one day I'd like to, I'd like to surplus some money and put it away for the future. But right now we're still not at the point where we have enough to activate the strategies as well as we'd like them to. So every dollar in is going back out into basketball.
[00:34:33] Speaker B: Another question that kind of follows this discussion. How do you feel the organization is that heading into another Olympic cycle when it comes to funding, sponsorship and support from stakeholders?
[00:34:44] Speaker A: Yeah, it's we, we've grown undoubtedly and we've got more money to invest in basketball than ever before, which is great.
Still not enough. And let's. We're all feeling it on a daily basis. The economy is pinched, cost of living is up and guess what? So is cost of travel and cost of hotels and that's a significant part of our budget. The Canadian dollar is low.
We spend a lot of money in international currency. That doesn't help government funding has been relatively flat, although I think we've done pretty well on the margins. A little bit and getting a little bit here and a little bit there because Canada basketball is recognized as a sport that is fast growing in this country and, and has the gathering power for the country, like a national pride element that we could deliver upon winning.
So we're doing okay there. But I'll use this, I've told this to a few people.
What we don't have is what pro sports have is an enterprise value that we can cash out on.
We're expected on an annual basis to operate at break even or better, which means everything new that we want to do, we have to self fund.
We're not an organization that is sitting on millions of dollars in cash reserves. We're just not. One day I hope to be, actually no one day I expect to be.
But we're not that organization yet and haven't been for decades.
But a pro sports. But you would argue if you were to look at us in a pro sport lens from where we were and say like 2019 to where we are now, would our enterprise value be a lot more?
[00:36:17] Speaker B: Yes, definitely.
[00:36:19] Speaker A: But I can't take that to a capital, I can't take that to a bank, cash that out to invest in our future, whereas a pro sport franchise could.
So the reality, we need people to view us as an investment vehicle, as an opportunity. And even if there's not a traditional investment return on it, have to recognize that the dollars we're putting into the system now will create economic value for the country, participation value through sport for the country, unification value through winning for the country.
Because we can't go to a bank with an enterprise value to invest in the next new thing. So we need other people to invest in us so that we can. And we need more of it.
[00:37:02] Speaker B: When you're meeting with people, do they. Does it seem like that message is coming across like hey, we can do like shape. Yeah, yeah, Jamal, like I'm like RJ Barrett. Like when you're talking to these, like, does it seem like they get like the vision you're selling?
[00:37:18] Speaker A: Yes. Yeah. And I think we have been pretty ambitious with our vision to say that we want to be the best in the world and also the best sport for Canada.
Not a lot of orgs out there holding themselves to that accountability, but we are.
So yeah, it's a compelling case.
It gets us into a lot of meetings. But still, at the end of the day, people don't make emotional decisions with their money.
They make value Decisions with their money. I'd like listen, when I started in 2021, people were making a bit more emotional decisions. At that time we had also just spent two years in our basements.
So people were happy to be out. They were happy to throw a little bit of money around because honestly, for a while nobody spent anything. Yeah, ultimately we need people to fall in love with the emotion of what we're trying to be and make an emotional decision. But what I can also tell you, it is a wise investment because this game of basketball is going to continue to grow in this country and it does reflect the values and the mosaic of this country that other sports don't. So if you're going to get behind something, this is the one to do.
[00:38:27] Speaker B: Talking about the game growing falls, you just gave me some takeaways.
[00:38:31] Speaker A: You can't even see the questions.
[00:38:33] Speaker B: But so many people sent in questions. Someone asked what are the biggest barriers across the country to grow the game in your eyes?
And then I think somebody also sent a similar question. It was how do we increase girls basketball participation across the can of Volleyball is on the rise. But what's your response to that? And just like the Bears kind of facing. Because it's hard to get a gym in Toronto.
[00:38:55] Speaker A: Yeah, facilities is a barrier.
Cost is becoming a barrier. But not necessarily registered costs. But because facilities are a barrier, those facilities that are available are charging a premium and in some cases they're too far away and then you've got to travel and then there's some travel costs. So cost as an aggregate is becoming a barrier.
I think the system design, or lack of design is a barrier. We have as much non member club or private club basketball happening outside of the membership system as we do inside. So connecting those dots and keeping everybody safe with policy and procedure and certified coaching is a barrier. It's impossible for a parent. Like parent. I'm a parent.
I think I signed our. I'm the team manager for my science U10 basketball team. I think I signed us up for an unsanctious tournament by mistake because like it's impossible to tell. And I'm in the game. Yeah, it's impossible to tell.
So there are a lot of barriers that we have to address. System strength is one of them. System connectivity is one of them. I'm trying to lobby government to make it almost illegal. I don't know how you would but how. Sport delivery at the community level must be only done through member participation. You must be a member of your PTSO or NSO because you ever going to drop your kid off at an unlicensed daycare?
No, no. But we do with sport all the time and that has to change.
[00:40:24] Speaker B: Off topic, thoughts on the prep school scene? Yeah, like, it's, it's. I feel like it's gotten insane.
I'm guessing you're kind of like watching from afar, but is that kind of like. Also, I'm guessing you're alluding to that too, where it's like a lot of this is uncontrollable and people are paying tens of thousands of dollars.
[00:40:41] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:40:41] Speaker B: And there's no path.
[00:40:42] Speaker A: And it's, it's kind of like, I've talked to many in the prep school world. We're like, I'd love more of it in this country. We need to figure out how to connect it. And actually, Ron Young in our office, we're talking about some strategies, even from a domestic competition standpoint, how Canada basketball might want to step up to create a prep school championships.
Because I'd like more opportunity in this country so that kids aren't going down south. That's a Jesse Tipping first one to ever tell me, like, if we do our job right, kids don't have to go down there. And I agree.
And him and Orangeville Prep have done a great job at fostering that ambition, as have many others. So I'd like to see the system thrive here, but it should be regulated and it should be connected.
[00:41:25] Speaker B: Talking about costs, the Canada Support Commission came out with a report that talked about the rising costs. I have a graph here that the commission found that sport has become increasingly expensive, exclusive and inaccessible. With nearly half of Canadian parents, 44% reporting they cannot afford to register their children in organized sport. We kind of touched on it. But like, what are your thoughts on that and it becoming this?
I think the head of the commission called it broken, unsustainable, fragmented. So, like, what are your thoughts on that?
[00:42:00] Speaker A: I had six meetings with the commission and I spoke a lot about that stuff too. Like, I completely agree. You know, what's almost gone, it seems, is house league sports.
[00:42:11] Speaker B: Thank you.
[00:42:12] Speaker A: And like, when I grew up playing sports, it was once a week, this sport, once a week, that sport in different seasons. Like, I certainly wasn't a high performance athlete, but I could play anything. It's tough to find house league sport.
And I live in Stratford, Ontario. There's a great hoops for fun league, 85 bucks that anyone can just go once a week on a Wednesday from 5:30 to 8:30, they cycle age groups through and the kids playing rep are Kind of voluntold to coach and it's a great connectivity. But it's hard to find house league sport right now. So that's a big part of why cost has spiked. Because parents will sign their kid up for the travel program. Because it's the travel program. So what do they do now? And I'll use a hockey example. My daughter's in the middle of the do 15 tryouts for next year.
Three divisions at every age group and no house league hockey in the town.
There could easily be a house league hockey if like back when I was a kid, there's one rep team per age group. There was only ever one rep team per age group. Now there's in Stratford, there's three. In Oakville, there's seven. Like it's crazy.
Yeah.
[00:43:23] Speaker B: It's insane.
Somebody asked this, I know he's not a youth sports guy, but will there be an expansion of the esports finally? I, I kind of added this because like obviously.
[00:43:34] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:43:35] Speaker B: I don't know if you have talked with people at youth sports, but do you have any thoughts on just like you sports in general in the landscape?
[00:43:40] Speaker A: Yeah, I, I'm a, I'm a big supporter of you sports as like it needs to continue and it needs to thrive in the basketball community. I've actually challenged Pierre CEO there and I've had some great chats about like how you sport actually might evolve if it's not the expanding 8. How do they add 3x3 to it? Because like 3x3 is an Olympic pathway now. 3x3 is also a career pathway. Athletes.
[00:44:07] Speaker B: You guys take a lot of U sports players to that.
[00:44:09] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:44:09] Speaker B: What would it look like potentially? You're probably thinking this too, like preparing them early on.
[00:44:13] Speaker A: Yeah. We're talking about development programs now at the PTSO provincial team level and how we might insert 3x3 into national championships. But imagine like I would that be cool? That'd be cool. I went to a Laurier Western game. I went to Laurier. So I went back a few weeks well into the season and there was probably seven or eight undressed players between the two teams. Why not suit them up and let them play 3x3 at halftime 10 minute game or first to 21 and have a point system where within the game that's already happening in 5 on 5, a whole separate 3x3 vertical in the same construct. It wouldn't actually cost more money at all because the athletes are there, the referee is there and it's halftime. So we could create more groundswell and understanding of like what 3x3 is. Because I'll. I'll challenge anybody that goes to 3x3 game to leave and have it not be your favorite version of live basketball. I'd be surprised.
[00:45:11] Speaker B: I was there.
Was it last summer when the provinces were all going against each other? That was lit.
[00:45:17] Speaker A: That was crazy. Under the bentway. It was awesome.
[00:45:19] Speaker B: Who was it? My guy Andrew Miller was hosting.
I think he took his shirt off at one point. Celebrating with the team. Like. Like it created that environment.
[00:45:27] Speaker A: Like it was. It's amazing experience for sure.
[00:45:30] Speaker B: Yeah.
Next question here.
What are some of the professional off court pathways in hoops?
I think someone's just asking, just generic. Like what, what can you do? Like say you're not the next Shea. Yep. Jambal, Lou Doro. What are some professional off court pathways?
[00:45:50] Speaker A: More than ever, which is great. You look at the cbo, you look at youth sports, you look at Canada basketball, you look at the PTSOs, there's more jobs in basketball than ever before. Listen, I'm an example of that. There was no chance I was gonna get a job as a professional athlete. Basketball was the sport that I loved, but my capacity, I think I peaked the driveway, but I found a job in it. And so, yeah, I think the challenge for people is to recognize that not all jobs are with the Toronto Raptors. And a lot of young people. I talk to young people all the time that are looking to make their way into basketball and they're like, how do I get a job at nlse? I'm like, don't yet.
Maybe eventually, eventually. But don't make that your goal as first and only door.
The great thing about going into small organizations, Canada basketball is one of those.
Your job description will be pretty broad.
You're not going to be a specialist at anything. But being a generalist, you're going to be required to do more than say your counterpart at the Toronto Raptors would be doing, because they have the resources to really create finite specialty jobs.
And you know, well, resourced organizations do that all the time. So hunt opportunities with the cbl. Hunt opportunities with like, I saw the KW Titans, you know, I passed through Kitchener on my way home. Like, go find jobs in basketball and sometimes take a risk and take the low paying, no paying opportunity to build that resume.
[00:47:20] Speaker B: Yeah, some people sometimes say, hey, I don't want to do the work unless it's I'm getting paid X amount. But I'll say this, a lot of people nowadays that you're seeing, you probably did no pain jobs. I did a lot of no pain jobs where it's like I. It helped me make a connection or something that ended up being a pain job. Right.
[00:47:43] Speaker A: So anybody. It's the same with putting in the work when nobody's watching.
Shay gets paid a very, very, very good amount.
[00:47:54] Speaker B: How much he makes to play basketball, Shake contract.
[00:47:58] Speaker A: It isn't 60 minutes. Every game that he's working, he makes
[00:48:02] Speaker B: four years, he makes 285 million.
Shay, man.
[00:48:09] Speaker A: So God damn. But when you break that down.
[00:48:11] Speaker B: From Hamilton, Ontario.
[00:48:13] Speaker A: Yeah, but when you break that down, think about it like it's not 60 minutes times 81 games divided into that total. That is the hourly wage for him because he's putting in work that nobody sees all the time. Which is the same as if you're trying to break into this career and work in sport. You're going to have to put in time and some of that time might be invisible time and. Or low paying time just to break in. And then once you're in control how hard you work, solve as many problems as you can for your boss and use that opportunity to thrive.
[00:48:52] Speaker B: Shay can do it. 285 million from Hamilton. 75 million a year. That's not even counting his like Converse deal and whatever he's making off of that. I'm asking next time I see him. I need 10k to hold down just for safety, you know, just the safety. That might be my first question next time I ask him because this is insane. No one should have this type of money. But he deserves it every hard working.
If you hear about the stories of him working out and the commitment.
[00:49:16] Speaker A: Can I just. An aside. Canada needs to wake up to the fact that Shay is ours, he is us.
And I don't think. I don't know if it's an OKC thing or whether it's just because he's actually for as globally known as he is, he's still pretty low personality in public on purpose.
Canada needs to wake up and see our players as ours. And I had a conversation with somebody the other day about like I feel between now and la, our organization's job is to really fuel an understanding that. Let's not look at them and say wow, they are good.
Let's look at them and say they are us and we are good. Like that's. That's got to be on us to try and stoke because the world pays attention to Shay sometimes I think more than our country does and that's on the country. We got to fix that.
[00:50:06] Speaker B: That's a good point. And I'm going into this Olympic saying, we have the best player in the world.
[00:50:10] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:50:11] Speaker B: Best play in the world. Anything can happen. You got the best play in the world.
[00:50:13] Speaker A: Feba, Math, fiba.
[00:50:16] Speaker B: Next question here.
Where do you see Canadian basketball being 10 to 15 years,
[00:50:24] Speaker A: continuing on this growth trajectory? For sure.
When you look down to our.
Our junior academy at 13 and 14 had 350 kids show up to try out.
And probably 10 years ago, all of them make that team, all of them make this program. And that's how quickly the skill in this country and skill capacity has elevated. So, listen, I think Canada Basketball will 10, 15 years from now be at a point where instead of necessarily, we're certainly not going to be an organization that isn't used to qualifying. We'll be in everything, and we'll be. We'll be really dissecting the why when we don't win medals rather than the medal just being like, that's the goal for us now. It'll be like, that's the expectation.
And now what color.
I do see that coming because the way that our athletes are performing in the age groups, the way that they're getting opportunities on big global stage in NCAA and professional leagues, they're learning how to lose, they're learning how to win, and they're learning how to be their best. And. And I think that will just continue to fuel the growth of the game, too.
[00:51:41] Speaker B: How is Canada basketball? The next question here is how. How's Canada basketball going to capitalize on the vibes of the Toronto tempo? The funny thing is, I seen you. I don't think you saw me that day, but maybe it was earlier this year or like maybe a year before you're sitting courtside at a TMU game with Teresa Rice. Like, I think you have a good relationship.
[00:52:00] Speaker A: Yeah, we're pals. Yeah.
[00:52:01] Speaker B: Tell me about that. And the question, how are you going to capitalize off the. The Temple's hot right now.
[00:52:05] Speaker A: Yeah, Temple's.
[00:52:06] Speaker B: Great reveal.
[00:52:07] Speaker A: That was great. Yeah. 10.
[00:52:08] Speaker B: Okay. No, no notes for me. That chord is amazing.
[00:52:10] Speaker A: Yeah, it's. It's good. I liked all the little. The little hidden messages on them, too. Listen, we're. We're thrilled.
Thrilled that the Tempo are getting a chance to tip off. Thrill that they're shining a light on women's basketball in this country.
Thrilled that Kia is going to get an opportunity to be the homegrown, a great opportunity for her, great opportunity for the franchise.
We won't capitalize because that almost makes it sound like it's nefarious, but We've got an opportunity to collaborate and for as much as the Tempo will do for their own like for their investors and their ownership group and create commercial value, they're going to create opportunity for girls and women's basketball in this country. That the one bone I have with Teresa that I laugh about is you can't call yourself Canada's team only. You're not a Canada's only team. We're also Canada's team and in fact, we've got a team full of Canadians. So we are creating ways already to shine a light on the fact that Canada's basketball team pro and Canada's team national team have a great working relationship. We're going to shine a light on each other. We've got some collaboration and programming ideas coming down the ladder too.
[00:53:22] Speaker B: Talking about the access to basketball question, getting back to this, somebody asked, is there any possibility having future basketball academies in smaller communities nationwide?
[00:53:34] Speaker A: Yeah, it's an investment issue.
We're in some pretty good conversations internally about what the next set of evolved competitive advantages and development opportunities look like and expanding academy. We're actually starting to have. Not starting to. We're in pretty advanced conversations in Quebec and British Columbia and in some other markets about how we can help deliver the academy, even if it is a provincial product, how we can insert some deliverables there.
Certainly it's a goal to have a more connected national academy system.
It'll take money, though.
[00:54:12] Speaker B: Next question here.
Someone asked, should Canadian coaches be coaching the Canadian national teams? What are your thoughts on that?
[00:54:20] Speaker A: Should Canadian coaches be coaching the Canadian national team?
[00:54:24] Speaker B: Like exclusively Canadian coaches should be. Should they be coaching the national teams? I think they mean either age group stuff or.
[00:54:30] Speaker A: Yeah, senior.
[00:54:32] Speaker B: What are your thoughts on that?
[00:54:33] Speaker A: Yeah, I think.
Yes, yes, but. Right.
We want to. And actually I think if you've seen certainly at the age group level, I think we've got 100% Canadian coverage now.
[00:54:48] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:54:49] Speaker A: With the recent announcements of men's and women's or boys and girls, I think we've got 100% minus maybe one on the men's side, senior. The women still, there's a significant number, I think majority US Coaches.
That was a time and place thing for us. We were looking for coaches that had a unique perspective and skill set of developing NCAA and pro athletes and experience in both.
Not a lot of Canadians have that. Carly is now going to get a chance to develop that as a WNBA pro. So it is our obligation as well. A guy like Marlo, Carly, others that are coming up through the women's coaching system to also create opportunity for them through our relationships and partnerships so that they can round out those skill sets so that the next time we go looking for that coach. With the multitude of skill sets and experiences, Canadians have it.
[00:55:44] Speaker B: Similar question, sort of somebody asked here, when are we going to expand our coach selection for national teams?
What's the process like? I'm guessing this is more of a Rowan Steve question.
[00:55:55] Speaker A: Yeah, for sure.
[00:55:56] Speaker B: But, yeah, what are your thoughts on like, expanding?
[00:55:58] Speaker A: You mean like selection more coaches on the bench?
[00:56:02] Speaker B: I don't. I don't know if they mean more coaches or just like maybe the pool that you look at.
[00:56:07] Speaker A: So I think. I think what you'll see this summer and through this summer, there's a pretty concerted effort to have more coaches involved.
There are only so many that can be on bench, though. Yeah, like, that's a FIBA rule.
[00:56:19] Speaker B: This is an ncaa.
[00:56:20] Speaker A: This is an NCAA or NBA where there's a second bench and a third bench. Like we're talking there's four allowed on the bench, period. Full stop. There's not even a second bench behind. If you are not on front bench, you are in the stands.
We will have more coaches in the stands than ever before.
We're making an effort which makes them on court coaches in practice and in development sessions. But so there is more opportunity on volume. And I think you'll see that in the announcements that come out pretty soon.
[00:56:47] Speaker B: Victorasso, we just had on the show, he was telling me he's going to be involved in the coaching process. I think that's a great hire. A guy that won two championships in the cbl. Just want a really college great hire. A lot of great coaches coming up. And I think you guys are always going to be looking at it like, hey, we want to add more. But, you know, also coaches got to produce. You know, you got to not produce, but I mean, like, give them a reason. You know, it's like to get the call up to.
[00:57:10] Speaker A: Yeah. And there's this just like there's going to be a whole lot of guys and a whole lot of women that deserve to be on the roster of 12 that won't be able to make it because there's only 12 spots. The reality is the same applies to coaches now. There's more than ever that are talented and there's only so many spots. So there's always going to be somebody that should be there that just can't be because numbers are numbers.
[00:57:33] Speaker B: Next question here. We're flying through them. I'm happy I think we're gonna get through most, to be honest with you.
Next question.
Sort of.
I don't know if you have thoughts on this, but will there be more?
This is, I don't think has anything to do with you, but will there be more Pro Am leagues in Canada, Moneyball tournaments for pro players. I saw something recently where like they're announcing like the Durham.
[00:57:57] Speaker A: Yeah, I saw that too.
[00:57:59] Speaker B: Toronto, like different districts. I got to find out who's running that kind of stuff. If anybody listen to this podcast knows I love for them to come on and like I think they're doing a pro league for GTA players, which is nice. But what are your thoughts on just because I don't think you can. You have a say on like if there's going to be more pro on leagues but what are your thoughts on now?
A few years back there was none. Before that there was the, it was the bounce, the OVO stuff that was happening. Crown League that was. Brought a lot of excitement to the city. Now I'm seeing Pro Ams left and right coming up and a lot of players. Dylan Brooks plays in a lot of them. Nikhil plays in a lot of them. I've seen Lennon Miller playing a lot. A lot of guys that obviously show up for Canada. What are your thoughts on Pro Am leagues?
[00:58:39] Speaker A: And yeah, it's the, it's the natural outcome of popularity and interest in the game and as long as they are happening in controlled and safe environments for player safety, for fan safety, all of that, like that's. We have to. I don't think we're ever at the point where the national organization would sanction that type of stuff because we, we probably. It doesn't work like that.
But you know, we do, we do have to have eyes on wherever possible and maybe, maybe it's on us to at least pay attention so that we can make some recommendations on ways to keep the playing environment safe. Because like the last thing you want in a Pro Am is a guy in his off season doing something, a woman in her off season doing something and having a career ending injury because of it. So. But listen, it's a natural outcome of the game's popularity and I would be worried if it wasn't happening more so than I'm worried that it is. Keep it free.
[00:59:36] Speaker B: Whoever's doing Pro Am leagues, I do not want to pay to go out to this.
[00:59:40] Speaker A: Please keep it free.
[00:59:41] Speaker B: The people that are doing it for free shout to you.
Yeah, but I think it's gonna become a money grab to Be honest, because a lot of players are going to be like, hey, yeah, how can we capitalize off of this? I got, I got a connection with certain player. Let me go make a buck off of this.
[00:59:53] Speaker A: So sometimes, and I've, I've said this too, my, my biggest fear for the future of basketball is the popularity of basketball. Because at some point it grows too quick, it becomes too privatized, it becomes too capitalized. And I do use that word sometimes in terms of like, taking advantage of the popularity. And without the system connectivity in place, it could break.
[01:00:15] Speaker B: Next question here, I'll do two more. I think we're at an hour mark. I know you got places to be. Got to get back to Stratford. Shout out, Strafford, Stafford. I don't know the drive.
[01:00:25] Speaker A: Shakespeare.
[01:00:26] Speaker B: I haven't been there. I don't think I've ever been to Stratford, to be honest. Shout out to Justin Bieber though, right?
[01:00:30] Speaker A: Great, great food scene, man.
[01:00:31] Speaker B: Great food scene. Chicken farm out there. Yeah, yeah. I gotta check it out. I gotta check it out. Last two questions that I, I really enjoyed this, these two questions because one of it kind of relates to what I kind of do. Right. But sort of here it asks, what are your thoughts on the lack of media coverage? Yeah, I think they mean in terms of like, coverage compared to like US Media.
[01:00:58] Speaker A: Yeah.
[01:00:58] Speaker B: When it comes to Canadian basketball, Canada basketball, what are your thoughts on that? And.
Yeah. What are your thoughts on the media coverage in general?
Let's be real, the US when they're at a sporting event, the whole world pulls up to that, right?
[01:01:14] Speaker A: Yeah. Their own media world. And the whole world tells that story. Listen, there's more storytellers, yourself included, Lee, Ben, for Canadian basketball than ever before.
But boy, it's still, it's still tough to see. And I use that example of Shay, like, Canada doesn't know Shea well enough because Canada hasn't told stories enough about Shea or Lou or Bridget or you name it.
So ultimately that's on the storytellers, but it's, it's on the country to demand the story and consume the story when it is told. So like we had the conversation last year, like, if we're going to put global jam on pull up, because we used to take crap for not having those kind of events. Now we're having those kind of events show up people. But then, same thing, if you're going to tell the story, read it, consume it.
Because that will lead to those in charge of media, who invest in media to see the supply demand engine that basketball Creates. If it is demanded by more, more people will cover it. So part of it is on the media ecosystem and the way that investments are being made right now.
[01:02:28] Speaker B: You know how crazy it is nowadays.
[01:02:29] Speaker A: But part of it is also on the consumer, the media consumer, to demand more basketball. And we're going to go through, you know, the next two months of NBA playoffs and every Canadian is going to, you know, quietly, or maybe even not so quietly paying attention to the Canadian that's in the playoffs. But you need to demand that those stories are told and then you need to demand that they're told when they're not playing for that team, when they're playing for their country or when they're not playing at all.
Because those are humans that we have to learn more about and fall in love with because they're amazing humans.
[01:03:00] Speaker B: Yeah, I think some people try. I try. I think it's, it's, it's just hard at times, especially when you think about legacy media. I'm trying to think about, I'm saying legacy and I work at the Toronto Star, so it's like, what can I say? But I think about the World cup when you guys were out there.
[01:03:17] Speaker A: Yeah.
[01:03:18] Speaker B: Think about the Olympics, the lack of media that were out there.
[01:03:21] Speaker A: Yeah.
[01:03:21] Speaker B: What were your thoughts during that? What was like, hey, I'm guessing you're also speaking to us and you're like, hey, like the budget's not that they're not sending people. You know, it's like, I want to get out to World cup in Qatar potentially. Right. I want, I want to get out there, but I'm like, am I going to get there? But it's like, you know, it's when
[01:03:35] Speaker A: it's a big deal that they actually sent the play by play team, you know, that the media cycle has, the media ecosystem has changed because gosh. And these are pandemic impacts of what we learned how to call it from remote on tube from home. And that's how they, that's how our bronze medal was called by Dan Schulman.
And then he got to go to the Olympics to call it and then unfortunately we didn't get in the middle of game to, to make him, you know, have that call. But yeah, ultimately it has changed. And it is like when you look at the media scrums for our teams who have never been this good and never been this most as talented as they are now, probably be smaller than ever because of just the way the media ecosystem, you know, the players notice that we notice that.
I don't have A magic solve for it. But I, I do know that Canadians love human interest stories and lean into these athletes because they are interesting humans.
[01:04:33] Speaker B: Yeah. And that's kind of why not to toot our own horn. But it's like, I want to follow these players early on. Right. So it's like. Because I remember Delano Banta getting drafted by the rappers and I was like, who's this guy?
[01:04:43] Speaker A: Yeah.
[01:04:44] Speaker B: From Rexdale. Like, no one knows this guy's story. It was kind of sad. But we gotta stop that.
[01:04:49] Speaker A: Right?
[01:04:49] Speaker B: We gotta like a guy that gets drafted into the NBA, that's from Canada. We shouldn't be surprised. Wnba, we shouldn't be surprised. We should know Latasha's name. We should know Cassandra Prosser. We should know Sierra. Sierra Williams. We should know these players. You know, so. Yeah.
[01:05:04] Speaker A: And we've been.
And maybe it's a.
It's a Canadian just because it hits differently, but we've been telling young Canadian hockey stories for decades. Right.
World Juniors sets Canada up as a nation to know that kid's name before his name is known to the world. We gotta be doing that for basketball. We gotta be doing that for women.
[01:05:30] Speaker B: Who's that one guy from Saskatchewan that got drafted? I'm trying to search up his name. You know what I'm talking about? Is it Connor Bedard?
[01:05:36] Speaker A: Oh, yeah.
[01:05:36] Speaker B: The amount of stories I heard, I don't follow hockey. I'm like, who's this Conor kid? I'm like, everybody. Like, I've seen everyone do a profile on this guy where he's small town. I'm like, too much about Condor to be honest with you. But we should learn more about guys.
[01:05:49] Speaker A: I'm not talking shade on hockey. I'm just saying, like it is. But. But good news is we have proven that we're into those stories. So now we just got to tell more of them about this next generation of basketball.
[01:06:00] Speaker B: Yeah. Like guys like Malice Saddler just had a historic season. A lot of guys like, go listen to the last podcast. I won't plug it too much. Last question for you before I let you go because we're over an hour now.
Someone asked, what's your favorite moment in Kenya basketball history?
Ah, too many choose from.
[01:06:20] Speaker A: No, I'm trying to not make it generic in the last five years because it sounds selfish. Because I've really been inside the ropes for the last five years.
You know that 12 point comeback against Spain to punch a ticket to the Olympics.
[01:06:37] Speaker B: Yep.
[01:06:38] Speaker A: If Canada, if that game was in prime time and all of Canada was Watching that would have been a moment that everybody is still talking about, especially after a 24 year hiatus from the Olympics. So being down as often as we were in that game and then seeing our athletes respond the way that they did and respond to each other and then be in the locker room after. And the true emotion that poured out of some guys who have been gutting it out like a Kelly and Dwight for so many years without that Olympic punch.
And guys like Shay and Dylan who were like entered the room and said, let's get us there, man. That, that was something to behold.
[01:07:21] Speaker B: Almost.
[01:07:22] Speaker A: Not almost. It was more emotional in the room that day than it was when we won the bronze a few days later.
[01:07:27] Speaker B: Interesting. My favorite moment being usa, let's get it done again.
[01:07:31] Speaker A: Yes.
[01:07:32] Speaker B: I don't care if it was bronze. That's my favorite moment.
[01:07:35] Speaker A: Yeah. The favorite moment I hear retold is when Kelly in that, in that huddle after USA tied it up in the bronze medal game going to overtime and he turns to everybody and says how lucky are we that we get another five minutes on the court together? Like man, you can bottle up that. You can build team with that forever.
[01:07:53] Speaker B: Yeah. Shout out to Kelly.
Michael, bro, I can't thank you enough for jumping on the podcast. Let's do a plug. Oh, you said something.
[01:08:01] Speaker A: Yeah.
[01:08:01] Speaker B: You have some exciting kitted out. But the exciting news, I'm expecting something to my. To the studio.
[01:08:09] Speaker A: Yeah, fair.
[01:08:09] Speaker B: Okay.
[01:08:10] Speaker A: Keep an eye out.
[01:08:10] Speaker B: Keep an eye.
[01:08:11] Speaker A: We're doing our first ever OVO collab this summer.
[01:08:13] Speaker B: OVO collab, Drake jersey. Nothing was the same.
[01:08:18] Speaker A: My guy Drax at ovo. Thanks for pulling that together.
[01:08:21] Speaker B: How did that come about?
[01:08:23] Speaker A: Listen, we've had a long term love affair with each other. I don't know if you recall, but In February of 2019, OVO sponsored our women's jerseys as they went to the Olympic qualifier.
I was working at MLSE at the time. My boss, Shannon, Hosford and Drex are great friends and collaborators. So that came together that way. We became friends through it. Shannon's still on our board. We've been talking about the right time, the right energy and this summer's it.
[01:08:49] Speaker B: I'm texting you, I'm texting you my size. I need a tracksuit. I need a. I'm also going to text some other guys. I know that that work for was garbage. Shooting stars get a gear. I need some cap. That's gonna, that's gonna go platinum. Especially Olympic time.
[01:09:02] Speaker A: Yeah, everyone go quick too. It'll go quick.
[01:09:05] Speaker B: Excited for that when can people expect that? Is that just a. I think we're dropping that.
[01:09:08] Speaker A: Late June, early July.
I'll leave that to ovo. They're the experts. But it's fun to be a part of the team. For sure.
[01:09:15] Speaker B: I dropped some Drake bars, but, you know, like, we. We'll chill on it. We'll save it for June. We'll save it for July. Michael Barley, can't thank you enough for, for joining us.
It's been a blast. Always answering the questions the people want to hear. And it's been a pleasure.
[01:09:28] Speaker A: Pleasure as well. Thank you.
[01:09:29] Speaker B: This has been the Canadian Basketball show, your go to spot for the latest news stories and analysis on Canadian basketball. Michael. And we out.
